If I meet women on is it possible for me to have "game"?

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My first question is: If I meet women on is it possible for me to have "game"?.

My next question is: Essay in The Atlantic Monthly magazine overlong and self-indulgent, but I think the author has a point. People have standards that are too high, no?..

Comments (17)

Your question was: If I meet women on is it possible for me to have "game"?.

Wow, this article was long.  But I hope the writer didn't think the end of the piece was convincing that no one took her up on the offer to leave their husbands, as if it's so easy, even if they wanted to.  The implication was that they were just complaining and really secretly are happy with the way things are, but some get stuck in a rut, get dependent, can't survivie on their own financially or stay for the sake of the kids, and so on....

I personally don't think standards should ever be lowered.  Maybe compromise is a better word, and remembering that no one is perfect, learning to accept habits that might seem annoying but can actually be endearing, etc   .

My last comment is that passionate love does not necessarily equate to instability in a relationship. ..

Comment #1

I read the article.  Everyone is different.  What I perceive as "settling" you may not.  It is important to see relationships realistically and to be in the right frame of mind to assess the viability of a partner or a relationship (thru - that is why Iusually do not multidate - too many things going on for me..

  I dont wish to compromise on certain aspects like respect, someone who "gets" me,  affection, common interests, being able to communicate with each other in play or in fight mode, and loyalty.  I dont have a physical type that I usually go for - attraction to me is very unpredictable.  Everyone has faults - the trick is...can you live with the particular faults of that person? Everyone has their dysfunctions and quirks...again...can you live with those dysfunctions and quirks?  Because the faults, quirks and dysfunctions arent going away.  Assess your deal breakers and go from there..

My first ex husband had (has?) a quirk that drove some people nuts - he always needed to express his discomfort or upsetness about a situation, even if it meant ruining your time.  So, if we were caught in traffic, he would need get upset and would need to discharge about it.  After a while I figured out a way to move him from his "stuck" place sometimes.  But I normally just let him rant about it fior a while and I didnt take on his emotions.  His mother would try to change his behavior and tell him that there was nothing to do about it but to make the best of it.  Sometimes he felt scolded and it just made matters worse.  As he grew up (we met in college) he did eventually start to see things differently in this one area and did try to (on his own) not allow those things to ruin his time..

But the fairy tale doesnt exist. It sells a lot of books and movies.  There is no prince charming who is waiting to sweep us off of our feet and make our lives stress free and filled with flowers and chocolates..

I posted this recently on this board: "New Rules of Attraction" - how thinking has shifted and the "pow wow" instantaneous first meeting may be unrealistic :

Comment #2

This article is beyond helpful to me...I actually think it will be life changing!  I have had so many frustrating questions and lack of understanding with regards to this issue.  I feel like someone has spoken honsetly to me as to how it all works and I am beyond grateful!.

I'm totally going to settle..

Comment #3

Thanks biggeranita for sharing this with us.  I heard about this on The Today Show and on many of the local radio stations.  I thinks there are some really good points in this article and that this topic will be discussed forever - literally!!.

I married Mr. Charming.  He made me feel like the center of his universe - at first.  I had been married almost 10 years and I came home to him having his bags packed and loaded in the car.  He was leaving and that was that.  He wasn't even the best looking man that I had dating (online dating with in my life, so I didn't think I was picking the ultimate mate..

Well after being divorced for a while, I jumped back into dating.  Yup - it's a jump.  I don't think there is any other way to do this.  The first guy was not a Mr. Charming, but ended up  not being for me.  Next - he was a Mr. Charming - almost to the extreme and what a "Beautiful Disaster" he ended up being.  So Next again - he's not a Mr. Charming, but I falling in love with him and am happy to say that my bf is a very good man.  He's  more than I asked for.  He's  not the most handsome man I've met, but I don't care.  I'm enjoying discovering all of the those little "things" about him.  I don't like everything about him, but the good is just right for me..

A couple of my friends (who are a married couple) told me once.  "If the next day continues to be better than the day before - then it's all worth it".  I was thrilled when I could tell them that I felt this way.  Now I'm not saying that some days aren't hard, but we work through these days and I still feel good about our relationship.  I still think that this was great advice!!.

So maybe what we need to do is rethink the title to this article.  I'm thinking something like...Choosing What Will Last..

What title would you give the article if you renamed it?.

Thanks again biggeranita,.




Comment #4

This woman (Gottlieb) sounds pathetic, and her "advice" is misleading at best.  Sure, I think you are setting yourself up for disappointment if you are looking for Prince Charming, but why do we as women set the bar ever lower for men?  Maybe that is why there are so few good ones to pick from..

Of course, I am coming from a different place because I am 46 and do not want children, but I would far rather be single and happy than to marry some putz I am not in love with so I can s*** out a baby and be a Mrs.

Gottlieb made the choice to be a single mother, now she bemoans the fact there is no one there to help her.  Too bad!.

I do not agree with her that a marriage should be run like a boring corporation with kids.  I don't care if the man makes big bucks or looks like George Clooney, but if and when I do remarry, it will be someone with whom I feel passion in additon to comaptibility. Why bother otherwise, especially if you don't want kids?  I could live with my brother if all I wanted was a roomate.  Hell, my cat is much less maintenence than most men...

Comment #5

I agree with you 100% - I started a post but crashed before I finished it. I am also mid-40s, no kids - and in no way would it occur to me to find some man to make do with just to be married. I don't have to and neither does anyone else - unless they choose to believe this drivel..

I thought her 'advice' was trite and demoralizing to women. the very thing she accused other pop culture relationship (thru books of - promoting marriage above love- is EXACTLY what she was doing!  She chose the easier route of saying 'you're not going to get what you dream about anyway so just take the first decent guy who comes along' .

It come across to me that babies and marriage are far more important that genuine happiness and intimacy. Sexless marriages may be ok for some people but not for a large portion of the population. Neither is being with someone you can tolerate or not feel great passion for - that's the difference in platonic and romantic friendships.   .

I think advocating 'being alone in a marriage' as something good or desirable just to say 'I'm married' is a huge disserve to the entire human population. People are unhappy enough in life because they settle into mediocre jobs - now we are supposed to settle into mediocre marriages too?.

Sorry - I think this author is way off the mark for women of any age.  Had she defined 'settling' as being realistic rather than 'making do with what's available' I might have found it having more useful. Any 'advice' that follows the lowest common denominator way of thinking is not worth the paper it's written on..

Don't settle for what ever comes along that happens to have a penis - that's what most of the women posting on these boards are already doing and they sure as heck aren't happy! Just be realistic in what really matters and what doesn't and always be true to yourself.


Comment #6

Beautifully put.  All one need do is look around at the people who are miserably married to know there are worse things than being in your 40s or older and single.  I know women who are in boring, passionless marriages, or, worse, abusive situations..

Again, I say maybe if more women set the bar higher, not lower, in what we expect in a partner, who knows, maybe men would step up to the plate and get their acts together.  Let's put it this way:  I am not asking for anything in a man that I myself do not offer.  To be honest, I spent many years finding myself and was a late bloomer after my divorce at age 27.  I have really only been *ready* and looking for the past five years, but it has been discouraging to say the least..

Just seems that finding someone to whom you are attracted and who has your non-negotiables is like finding a needle in the haystack..

This probably should go on the online dating (online dating with board, but another pet peeve I have is the men online who think that Keira Knightly or Anjolina Jolie shoud be on the other end of the computer.  Then, you see their pictures or meet them in real life, and they are not all that but think they are a prize....which unfortunately supports what Gottlieb describes in her article..

Jeeze, I'm attractive , but if I was Playboy material, do you really think I would be on eharmony????  LOL..

Comment #7

Yes - I know!  our society seems to think that dumbing things down to the lowest common denominator is what makes everyone happy....this is why I dislike 'political correctness'.  If we keep lowering our standards - not just in mates, but in character and education and such, so that no one gets left behind, who exactly has been helped? Certainly not the high performer who gets teh same raise and recognition as the one who just shows up.....we are only as strong as our weakest horse, so it makes sense to help the weaker become as strong as s/he can be rather than allowing the stronger to match paces with the weaker..

People do what is required of them. if women require more instead of less from the men in their lives, then the whole next generation would come up knowing what respect and trust mean.  If we all required integrity in how we treat ourselves and others, then settling and dumbing down and political correctness would be unnecessary - but since that's harder to commit change to, lets just require less! HA! .

I always keep the 80/20 rule in mind - a good match will be about 80 of the things I want or need in a relationship (thru - but if something that is HUGELY important to me is missing, like sexual attraction!! - no deal. The part that is not there may be smaller but is also important.  But you must know what you want and what is/isn't important - and most people don't have a clue. (Perhaps this is a gift of being over 40??.

I will never 'settle' when it comes to character and being true to myself. I know what kind of man I want in my life and I know what I want my life to be like. I also know what is and isn't deal breakers for me - and the things she suggested - SHEESH!!!.


Comment #8

I agree with you and tonitoons. There is a difference between being realistic  about expectations and settling.  Women who have been walking around with their head in a cloud, with a sense of entitlement could be the ones who are now advocating settling as an option.  Which really means...that they still dont "get it.".

I too would rather be single than compromise what I expect from a relationship. I knew a woman once who was just satisfied that her husband brought home a paycheck..he did nothing else for her or the marriage, but he brought home money and that seemed to make her happy.  That is a sad life...

Comment #9

"I agree with you and tonitoons. There is a difference between being realistic  about expectations and settling.  Women who have been walking around with their head in a cloud, with a sense of entitlement could be the ones who are now advocating settling as an option.  Which really means...that they still dont "get it."".


Exactly!  I can't even remember a time in my life where I was walking around thinking I wanted an Ivy league-educated, Brooks Brothers suit-wearing man who looks like JFK Jr and drives a Porsche..

I've known lots of women like Gottlieb,  and they do have a sense of entitlement.  Some of them think because they went to a certain college or grew up in a monied family that no one is perfect enough for them.  Mind you, many of the ones I know did marry "well" and appeared to have the ideal family, but ended up divorced or miserably living a facade to impress society.  You never know what goes on behind closed doors until people air their dirty laundry publicly..

Surely there is a happy medium between that type of thinking and "settling."  That is what I strive for.  I will never accept the type of men that Gottlieb describes in her article thinking that is the best I can do or I have to have a man to validate myself.  Yuck!..

Comment #10

Entitlement and expectations go a long way into feeding the hysteria of settling. Settling comes from a core belief of 'not deserving' and ' not existing' - good men exist in all walks of life - and there are many good men available for any woman - but if she has some fanatsy image of what he should be like, then she won't and can't 'see' what is right there before her.

As the saying goes - look for beauty, you won't find love. Look for love and you always find beauty..


Comment #11

No woman should use a man to validate herself as a human being.  Yet...we all love romance.  So, like you said there is a happy medium that works for us..

What I find that is so "out there" about how so many women are thinking is that by being unrealistic they fulfill a notion that they will end up alone (which is also called not being good to themselves) and now that they want to "settle" they continue the notion that they are still undeserving of a good life with a man who they do want.  Their behavior is highly dysfunctional, IMO...

Comment #12

"there are many good men available for any woman" > I hope you are right because I hope to reenter the dating (online dating with world eventually.   .

"but if she has some fanatsy image of what he should be like, then she won't and can't 'see' what is right there before her." > absolutely, because that means she is not experiencing what it really is like to be with him. .

"As the saying goes - look for beauty, you won't find love. Look for love and you always find beauty."> I dont have a physical type that lots of women have.  I have dated tall, short, blond, brunette, facial hair, no facial hair and all of those things really dont compute into a "type" for me.  I find that my attraction usually goes deeper than the surface..

One of my concerns about dating (online dating with is that because of what happened to me (I hope you remember me posting about my victimization) some men might be drawn to me because they feel sorry for me or because of  the voyeuristic aspect  of my victimization (everyone knows what happened me) - so it is really sympathy or the thrill of voyeurism that draws them, not me..


Comment #13

Interesting, to say the least.Fully less than half of all marriages in this country fail for one reason or another.This will continue to be the case so long as the majority sex feels it their rightto have the minority change their lifestyle, solely to suit their wishes.MOO.


Comment #14

Well, if the majority sex (I assume you mean men) has been able to get the minority sex (I assume you mean women) to jump when they say jump I would say that the fault lies 50/50. - Marriages fail because people get into them too quickly and expectations are not realistic - that will never go away...

Comment #15

Majority = womenMinority = menAt least according to the latest census figures..


Comment #16

Depends on which age group you are looking at.  Either way, the quality of men available seems to be abyssmal at any age.  Doesn't matter what the *quantity* is.  Meaning, before anyone accuses me of being a man-basher, it appears easier in most age groups to find a good, stable woman who is halfway attractive than it is to find her male counterpart.  *Not * to say there are not some great men out there, don't misunderstand me..


The "Man Shortage" theory just gives men more of a license to be substandard, in my opinion.  If I were in the 18-24 age group, I'd be p***ed at Dubya, because he is surely a "widowmaker."..

Comment #17

This question was taken from a support group/message board and re-posted here so others can learn from it.


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